Can we have aur helper selection in installation iso?

[indy]

@WestAus

Through unfortunate reasons, others lack the mentally ability for it, yet gaming is one of the most important aspects to get them through their day, keeps them mentally active, even if they can’t be physically.

Agree. I was surprised that some Windows games have better FPS in Linux.

[indy]

You tempted me!

[indy]

Could not get the angry mouth on the mask!

[iSpeakVeryWell]

I could not resist the urge to use your angry face as my profile picture! I hope you don’t mind!

[WestAus]

It’s more about seeing something someone else has that apparently works better, throwing a tantrum until they get it, then dealing with the issues to keep it working for them.
But as inffy says above, many youtubers are more about the pros vs cons

[indy]

You are so funny!

[indy]

Yeah! Clickbait.

[iSpeakVeryWell]

@WestAus

user friendly

User friendliness Is something very relative.

For example, I consider Arch Linux to be way more friendlier than Windows. And my reason is very simple. I find it way easier and faster to have a system that perfectly meet my needs when I build it from nothing versus Windows where I have to spend many hours removing bloat and changing settings.

[inffy]

@WestAus

It appears AUR is as safe as downloading from browser app stores, no control over what’s on there, reliable reviews/comments are rare.
Only safe for those who know what’s what, which is likely less than 0.01 of the worlds population.

AUR is always “wild west” and you need to know what you are looking for. As AUR is not moderated anyway, always check the comments on packages. Bad packages will be removed if someone reports them

But in the end its the end users responsibility when usin AUR. AUR can be great but it will always have the “what if…” moment

[Danny_Barron]

I agree totally. I can see and vary what spices are in my Linux vs the ‘secret spices’ of Windows.
And changing out one piece (ie an aur helper) is usually just one command.

[inffy]

User friendliness is hard beast. Arch lets you somewhat build your sustem but not as well as Gentoo or something like that.

But when it comes user help I would say Fedora or Ubuntu are way more user friendly. They welcome new user more openly. It always depends on the user interactions and Arch users expects atleast somekind of self learning. You will easily get the RTFM answer if you ask something really really basic.

Arch derivatives help here as they usually want to be more user friendly than stock Arch (like Cachy or EndeavourOS)

[iSpeakVeryWell]

@Danny_Barron

And changing out one piece (ie an aur helper) is usually just one command.

IMO, there are two things that matter when it comes to AUR helpers when using a GUI installer to install an arch-based distro.

1. Being clear about if one is provided or not.
2. If one is provided, state which one.

Why?

If no AUR Helper are installed, I know I gonna have to provide one by myself. I’m totally fine with that.

If one is provided but you don’t tell me which one… what’s the point of that?

If you tell me yay is going to be installed, now I know that I can do:

❯ yay -S paru && paru -Rnsc yay

[Danny_Barron]

Excellent point. Often a failing in Linux distros is the documentation. I understand it, who wants to write documentation

[Sunda-Spirit]

Good question.

Cry for help and resignation

Shortly before the Open Source Summit EU in September 2024 in Vienna, there was a small earthquake in this area. Alejandro Colomar resigned from his position as main administrator of the help pages (man pages) for Linux. The reason for this is simple: he can no longer afford this voluntary role. In other words: either a sponsor can be found to maintain the help pages, or Alejandro devotes his work and time to tasks that are linked to payment.

Linux: Kein Geld für Dokumentation

[Danny_Barron]

I have an opinion here (not a fact…just an opinion). I think man pages are invaluable, but I think they’re not enough anymore. I frequently will man something, but to find usable information and configuration, I usually have to go elsewhere (just saying).
Though it’s like I said earlier, there’s only so much ‘free’ work that will be done.

[WestAus]

@iSpeakVeryWell

when I build it from nothing versus Windows where I have to spend many hours removing bloat and changing settings.

Is anyone “building it from nothing” if using something mostly done?
That would be like saying you built a wardrobe purchased from Ikea, because you screwed it together.
Pretty sure the Cachy Devs built this for you? And apparently pretty easy to install anything it doesn’t come with that you want.

Maybe “many hours” when you first started learning how, bet you got quicker at it. Just like you do when changing things to your liking after installing any L distro.

Bloat started getting worse after W7, those who cared, wanted to squeeze everything they could for gaming performance, did what they thought was best, followed online guides, blacklists, back & forth with forum posts, etc.
Look at many posts on Linux forums, reddit, what’s changed?

[WestAus]

@inffy

AUR can be great but it will always have the “what if…” moment

Which is why it’s safer for those that don’t know what’s what, to stick with the installer built into the OS.

@WestAus

managed via a reliable source, like those who supply DNS lists, uBlock, etc.

[WestAus]

@inffy

You will easily get the RTFM answer if you ask something really really basic.

I had my head down in shame asking for help how to install PIA correctly, should be basic, right?
But go to the AUR page, let me know if you can see anything related to how to actually install it, incl comments. And it’s the same for everything else I looked at on there.

I used the info on PIA site, got “limited connection” notice.
Spent hours trying to find someone that already asked/answered, etc, which I ended up doing here.
After following advice to uninstall/install correctly, my nic stopped, couldn’t find a solution.
As I’ve learnt over the years, much quicker to just reinstall vs hours searching.
Then it turns out in another reply from same advise, “limited connection” notice is (apparently) a normal issue with PIA

@Sunda-Spirit

In other words: either a sponsor can be found to maintain the help pages

Similar with Wikipedia, never used to get notices asking for donations. etc

[Sunda-Spirit]

@WestAus

Which is why it’s safer for those that don’t know what’s what, to stick with the installer built into the OS.

Pacman is the Arch Linux package manager.
Paru is an AUR helper that is pre-installed.
AUR is: Arch Linux - Wikipedia

@WestAus

Similar with Wikipedia, never used to get notices asking for donations. etc

With one small difference: Wikipedia has been funded by donations since the beginning.

@WestAus

But go to the AUR page, let me know if you can see anything related to how to actually install it, incl comments. And it’s the same for everything else I looked at on there.

https://aur.archlinux.org/packages/piavpn-bin?O=10
It couldn’t be easier.

[iSpeakVeryWell]

@WestAus

@iSpeakVeryWell

when I build it from nothing versus Windows where I have to spend many hours removing bloat and changing settings.

Is anyone “building it from nothing” if using something mostly done?
That would be like saying you built a wardrobe purchased from Ikea, because you screwed it together.

I meant “it’s easier to add things you need than remove things you don’t need” if you will.

@WestAus

Pretty sure the Cachy Devs built this for you?

Yes and no. Yes they build the packages from source code for me, so your technically not wrong here. No because this was not what I was referring to when I used the word “build”. I was referring to the fact that I did an Arch Linux install from scratch using the Arch iso, configured it and optimized it until I’m happy with it and then switched my repos to use CachyOS packages. It’s the Arch way, you build your system the way you want it.

Let’s say you buy a 10000 pieces LEGO. Let’s say a big space ship! Arch and CachyOS maintainers provide the blocks, and you, you build it! It’s the same with your wardrobe example. It may not take as long and be as complex then doing a 10000 pieces LEGO or installing Arch Linux the way you want it, but in the end, you still the one who build it! IKEA is the manufacturer in this case, not the builder.

@WestAus

Maybe “many hours” when you first started learning how, bet you got quicker at it. Just like you do when changing things to your liking after installing any L distro.

Bloat started getting worse after W7, those who cared, wanted to squeeze everything they could for gaming performance, did what they thought was best, followed online guides, blacklists, back & forth with forum posts, etc.

Not to be rude, but personally, I’m done speaking about Windows. I have been able to remove the shackles that locked me to it for years and that’s all that matter. And it’s not just Windows, it exist many Linux distro that are not better than Windows. To me, what matter is that I found Arch and I can’t feel more at home than that!